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023: Part 2 of Bill Reel, Backfire Effect, Confirmation Bias and its Accompanying E-Book!

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This is part 2 of a 2 part series where Bill Reel and Dr. Kristy Money discuss confirmation bias, the backfire effect, and how understanding these concepts can help you avoid hurtful behaviors between those who are journeying away from orthodoxy and their believing friends/family. There are references to different podcasts mentioned in the episode and you can find at the end of this post.

Lastly, in conjunction with the release of this episode, we are publishing a new e-book titled “How People Change Their Minds About Religion: Do’s and Don’ts”. It is provided as a free resource by the Healthy Mormon Journeys Foundation and can be downloaded at hmjfoundation.org/materials.

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit hmjfoundation.org/donate. Thank you.

Show Notes:

022: Bill Reel, the Backfire Effect, and Healthy Practical Tips for Journeyers

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This episode is part 1 of a 2 part series. Today Dr. Money and Bill Reel discuss where he currently stands with his faith journey, healthy and practical ways to journey, and the backfire effect.

Bill Reel experienced a faith journey while serving as a Mormon Bishop in his early 30’s and currently podcasts at mormondiscussionpodcast.org where he discusses how to let go of “a MORMONISM that is unrealistic, too simplistic, and too black and white”, and develop a “renewed faith. A beautiful and expansive faith”. Also, hope you enjoy the new bumper music by Josh Vietti. You can check him out at joshvietti.com.

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit hmjfoundation.org/donate. Thank you.

021: Dr. Kristy Money on Her Journey, the Birth of the HMJ Foundation and the New “When a Loved One’s Beliefs Change” Infographic

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In today’s episode, we get a behind-the-scenes peek at the origins of the Healthy Mormon Journeys Foundation and the Healthy MoJo podcast, as Marco interviews Dr. Money about her journey away from orthodoxy and how that led her to found the foundation. Dr. Money goes over the principles guiding the foundation and its work, including the symbolism of the feather. She then discusses the foundation’s newest resource for preserving relationships after changes in faith, a practical and powerful infographic called “When a Loved One’s Beliefs Change.”

We are purposefully releasing this resource during the busy season of LDS General Conference to empower those on either side of the faith aisle so that all of us can avoid harmful behaviors and embrace relationship-building ones. That is our bread and butter here at the HMJ Foundation – helping people preserve their closest and dearest relationships even when beliefs change.


Links referenced in episode:

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit hmjfoundation.org/donate. Thank you.

020: Mindy Gledhill on Parental Transparency and Avoiding Fear & Shame Based Responses

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In today’s episode Dr. Money talks to Mindy Gledhill, an amazing indie singer/songwriter who stands up for important issues in her native Utah, particularly among LDS communities.


They answer a listener’s question who asks for help discussing her feelings about gender inequality inside the church  with her father who currently serves as an Area Authority Seventy. This listener wants to be open and honest with her family, but worries about damaging or losing her relationships with them.


In response, Dr. Money and Mindy discuss the important concepts of “differentiation” and “enmeshment.” When these ideas are employed, they go a long way towards improving one’s personal mental health and building healthy relationships.

In terms of links, please check out Mindy’s work – she’s amazing!
Mindy’s open letter to Elaine Dalton
Mindy’s amazing music
Mindy’s new project (incredible)
One of Dr. Money’s favorite videos…Seriously, the cinematography in Mindy’s videos is lovely/amazing/captivating/all of the above!!

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit hmjfoundation.org/donate. Thank you.

019: Strengthening a Friendship While Disclosing a Faith Journey

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In this episode Dr. Money along with Marco, our podcast editor, and two of his active LDS friends, Saul and Katelyn attempt to answer a listener’s question about how to disclose their faith journey to a close friend without losing that valued friendship.

We discuss how Marco disclosed his own faith journey with Saul, how he and Katelyn reacted, and best practices for assuring the disclosing doesn’t turn into a burned bridge.

For context, you can find the letter Marco wrote to disclose his faith journey to Saul.



My friend – I like these catch-up sessions. I’ve probably started this email 10+ times but pulled back because I didn’t know how deep these emails should be. Then I thought: “hey, you’re talking to your friend Saul” and I decided I’d be transparent….

[omitted non-relevant content]

…The last point I want to touch on is my faith. Besides my wife and my Bishop Saul – you’re the first person I’ve commented about this and I’d love to get your thoughts/insight. I’ve always tried to be a good person – I do have my faults, but I’ve always to tried to overcome them. I’ve always felt the Church was a place where I could grow and improve. But I have to tell you that about 4 months ago in Sunday school we were talking about the Priesthood and how in 1978 it was opened to all worthy males. It is a topic that always made me sick to my stomach. It seems so odd now that was the norm back then and I asked the older members what was the reason given at the time. Some brought up the curse of Cain (which is doctrinally unsound) then there was awkward silence and we moved on. But Saul – I couldn’t get it out of my mind. Especially understanding that Joseph Smith had in fact ordained black members of the church – what changed?

It nagged at me and I begin to research. Saul, it occurs to me that there is a chance that you might construe this as my attempting to convince you at some point, I want to assure this is not the case – I am merely attempting to clarify what my thoughts are/were so I can attempt to gain more understanding on my feelings. With that said, the sick feeling in my stomach led me to research. I wanted to try to gain an understanding of when/why things changed after Joseph Smith as perhaps it would shed light/understanding and bring me to a satisfying resolution. It was hard to find non anti-mormon information on the topic, but I did find information.

The Church’s position is that for reasons unclear today sometime while Brigham Young was the prophet, the practice changed. This practice was continued on for almost 100 years until 1978. Long story short (because I need to get ready for work) – I am pained to think that the tenants that I’ve held to for so long could be wrong. I’ve always believed that the Prophet is the voice of the God – and that should he think of doing something against his will God would take him from this earth. Sadly this did not happen for Brigham, nor for all of the prophets for near 100 years. It is hard for me to believe that God wanted that practice changed – that he would put aside certain people for that long. So I’ve made a decision to put a pause on Church for now. I’m sure this all sounds crazy. It is really hard for me to bring this up w/ anyone. I want to want to try to get some feedback – I’ve continued to pray, and well friend, I hope you can give me some insight.

Sorry if this email is too heavy – but it is simply on my mind. I really appreciate your friendship Saul. Please give my best to your family!

[End Letter]

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit hmjfoundation.org/donate. Thank you.

018: Validation & Respect Exercises for Mixed-Faith Couples

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In this episode, we interview a mixed-faith couple who is making it work. They discuss how one of them began to journey away from the church, how that affected each of them, and what they strived to do to make sure they could focus on strengthening their relationship through the process.

They also model the exercises in Part 2 of the Mixed-Faith Marriage Workbook found on the HMJ Materials page.

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit the HMJ Donation page for more details. Thank you.

017: Sis. Jan Chamberlin on Leaving MoTab and Parenting When Children Leave The Church

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In today’s episode, Dr. Money introduces a new survey which has tremendous potential to help others working through their faith journeys – so we need as much participation as we can get! (it takes 1 min – click here to participate).


Dr. Money also spends time with Jan Chamberlin, discussing her reasons for resigning from the Mormon Tabernacle Choir (MoTab). Additionally, Jan helps respond to a listener’s question about her relationship with her son who has left the church. Jan gives personal insight into how she, as an active Latter-day Saint, has worked on maintaining a strong and fruitful relationship with some of her children who have journeyed away from orthodox LDS beliefs.

The Families and Faith Journeys survey is about family reactions to belief changes. It will take about 1 minute and the HMJ Foundation will use the completely anonymous/confidential results to protect and improve relationships despite changes in belief. Click on this link to participate.

Also, for those interested, here is a link to Jan Chamberlin’s CNN interview about her decision to resign from MoTab.

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit hmjfoundation.org/donate to help us further this work. Thank you.

016: Discussing Your Faith Journey With Your Missionaries

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In today’s episode Carrie and Ross from the acclaimed podcast “Oh No Ross & Carrie” (do yourself a favor and check them out ohnopodcast.com) help us answer a listeners question who is concerned about being honest/transparent about his faith journey away from the church, both with himself and the missionaries who baptized him, while at the same time not lose the friendship they currently enjoy.

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit HMJfoundation.org/donate to send your tax-deductible donation. Thank you.

015: In-Laws, Faith Journeys, and Boundaries

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In today’s podcast Dr. Money, along w/ her active LDS father-in-law answer a caller’s question regarding how to negotiate their in-laws who disagree with her and her husband’s faith journey away from the LDS Church. If discussions of appropriate boundaries and the best way to set them peak your interest, the Healthy Mormon Journey foundation has prepared a workbook called “Faith Journeys and Boundaries: A Practical Workbook” available as a free download at hmjfoundation.org/boundaries.

Any material in this podcast or hmjfoundation.org/materials, are provided free of charge for those looking to maintain important relationships after changes in belief. If you find value in this content and feel the HMJ foundation can help others, a one-time or monthly recurring donation of anywhere between $1-20 goes a long way to help us help others. As a 501(c)(3) registered non-profit organization, any donations to the Healthy Mormon Journeys foundation are tax deductible just like tithing donations would be. Thank you.

011-014: Kevin Rahm on Growing up Mormon, Mission, BYU, Acting Career, and Reaching Peace and Balance

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EP011: Dr. Kristy Money marks off one of her bucket list items as she interviews actor and former Mormon, Kevin Rahm. In this first of four episode series, Kevin discusses growing up Mormon, his LDS mission, along with his initial questions and doubts. 

EP012: In this second of four episode series, Kevin discusses his time at BYU, discovering acting, and the beginning of his faith journey.

EP013: In this third of four episode series, Kevin and Dr. Money answer a listener’s question regarding balancing truth vs happiness. They also discuss external vs internal validation along with raising their children with the experience of themselves having been raised in an orthodox environment.

EP014: In this fourth of four episode series, to introduce a mental health break, Dr. Money gets all fan-girl on Kevin’s impressive fimlography.

If you find this content useful a one-time or recurring donation will go a long way to help us help others. Visit hmjfoundation.org and click on the blue “Donate” button. Thank you.